I was getting pretty upset reading about the heartache this young woman was facing

All I have to do is look at my own family to realize how important they are to me, as opposed to anything else – as long as I can provide for them, I would never ask them to go without just for some “business opportunity.”

All relationships need to be built on a foundation of trust. This guy has shown from the beginning that he can’t be trusted (lied about his success, etc). She, and her child, deserve so much better & if he doesn’t realize that – then she needs to strike out on her own. If she does have money coming, she needs to use it to support her & her child – and if her so-called fiance tries to convince her otherwise, he’s showing his true, true colors.

When I read a story like yours it breaks my heart as well as makes me quite angry

The problem is a lot of people, even the ones that know the truth (that the profit comes from the CDs, the conventions, and so on and NOT the product) are so steeped in denial and the lies that are repeated over and over that they believe what they’re saying. It’s an amazing case of double-think, where they can say A in one sentence, then B in the next and literally not understand that the two contradict each other. While it may seem like a strong word, brainwashing is appropriate and accurate in this case. They have been brainwashed to believe all this stuff.

Now the hard part, and what is important to accept, is that they really do believe all this and that you cannot tell them anything and expect them to believe it. They are brainwashed into believing that this is the only way they’ll ever reach the point of being wealthy and that the alternative is to have a miserable life working 40 hours a week for 40 years.
loanscash100
The blogs like this also target people in your age blog because many don’t have the experience to know what a load of crap the business is.

We know that you can’t tell these people (as in those brainwashed and, essentially drones who do whatever their upline tells them to do) anything about “the business.” The current thinking is that questions may work. We haven’t seen evidence it makes a difference, but the idea is to try to raise questions in their mind that may make them rethink some of the brainwashing. In this case, one thing that I’d bring up is that he told you he was a Platinum, but you know he wasn’t and he later said they teach to “speak it into being.” So how does he know what his upline are, in reality? It might go like this:

You: “I’m confused about something in your business.”
Him: “What?”
You: “You told me that you’re supposed to speak something into being, which is why you said you were Platinum when you weren’t yet and cash loans from fueloans.com remember that?” (Of course he’ll remember :) )
You: “So what I don’t get is how do you know, when other people say where they are, that they’re not doing the same thing?” Let him stew on that and see where you can probe and what you can do to probe deeper. Then you might get to the point where you can say, “But if this is what THEY tell you to do, then how can you be sure they aren’t doing the same thing?

Do it GENTLY because any time anything like that comes up, part of the fear on their end is that you can later say, “I told you so!” They have to be clear that you’re NOT setting them up to see the business as bad, just that the focus is on this one small part.

Now on to the other parts of your story.

As for marrying him, I’m not big on some of the traditional models of marriage – the idea that the wife stays home and takes care of the kids while the man goes out and makes a living. However, I do think it’s important that both partners hold up their share of the relationship, emotionally, financially, and so on.

I don’t want to judge your relationship, but I can tell you that there are a few things you will be expected to do if things continue. You will be expected to play the part of the dutiful, adoring, supportive, and admiring wife. This means going with him when he shows “The Plan” and sitting quietly, looking up at him with admiration because you’re just so proud and tickled pink and how wonderful he is and how great his success is. The pressure will be on you, more and more, to become the kind of wife they want you to be.

This is not a blog that admires or respects, or even understands individuality. They fear it. They want all their IBOs to think the same way, to talk the same way, to follow the same rules, and so on.
This also applies to their families. They have this image of all their IBOs doing well and having a community where all the families are like those in “Leave it to Beaver,” except much more church oriented and all are super-wealthy. Look at how his upline and everyone involved is and look at how they have, already, started to put pressure on you to be the way they want the wives of the IBOs to be.

It’s important to consider this. Ask yourself if you see any reasonable chance that he will leave this on his own. Do you think it’s likely he’d leave the business without him reaching utter failure and being abandon by them if he can no longer spend the money on the tools that enrich his upline? Consider this. I’ll touch on this again, later.

Now here’s one of the most important points: money you inherit. I don’t know the laws in PA. I do know in VA that whatever I inherit, whether before or during a marriage, is MINE. I can’t lose it in a divorce. If I move out of VA, THEN get divorced, I could get taken for everything my Father has already left me (and I’m not married yet). Since that is tied in with my Mother and Sister (I won’t go into it here), I *have* to get a prenup if I ever get married again.

In your case, you MUST do everything you can to protect any inheritance. Remember that it’s quite possible that you can have it all in bank accounts and trust fund in your name, but that he might get your PIN or find other ways to access the account, but not strictly legally. He has been brainwashed to believe the end justifies the means and the end is him being so wealthy he can easily afford to take care of you and your daughter in style for the rest of your lives, so that would, in his eyes, make it acceptable for him to take $50, then $100, then a few thousand, and so on, from any of your accounts in the name of taking care of you and his “family.”

In other words, do NOT marry this man yet. He has not yet proven he can take care of his own needs by himself, much less contribute on a fair basis to a joint household that includes him contributing his fair share to your daughter’s needs — and that includes not just financial, but emotional as well. If you do marry him, you are in danger of losing all you could inherit to him. Another point is what’s happened with his bank account. You want to keep your finances separate from him because he is going to have to deal with the results of what he’s done for a long time.

The best chance of getting him out of the business is for him to be broke and to have no money to spend on the tools. When that happens, they all will drop him like a hot potato. Their sole purpose of keeping him in and befriend him is because all the money he spends on tools is making his upline wealthy. While they have different ways of putting it, they are trained to drop someone once they stop spending money on tools. They measure someone’s commitment to the business based on how much money they spend on the tools. Basically, their love is bought and the more one spends, the more they love him.

So now I’m going to ask you a number of questions about yourrelationship. These are to give you a few things to think about in terms of just what is going on and what kind of situation you are in.
What does he do to help with your child? Does he ever change diapers, feed her, or do anything else to take care of her? How about housework? In other words, how much of his life is going to his job, then doing “the business?” Is he so caught up in this that he’s not contributing to anything else?

What I’m asking or suggesting you evaluate is if he brings anything to your relationship or takes from it. Is he just another burden on you while you’re doing most of the work of raising a child on what amounts to your own, or is he giving to the relationship?

If he’s not contributing much, you may be better off moving out and living on your own. Then you don’t have to fight over finances, you can focus on your work and child, and he is left to his own devices. If he ends up not paying the rent and getting evicted, it’s not your problem at all. (You’ve already seen that he doesn’t care about these things because he knows you will take care of it when he won’t.)

The idea in doing this is it helps in 2 ways: 1) It keeps you from enabling him by letting him spend his money however he wants, then expecting you to fill in the gaps and pick up what he won’t take care of, and 2) If he is not contributing to the relationship and you’re essentially raising your daughter on your own, then it won’t make a difference whether you’re living with him or not and it’ll remove the distractions he’s causing. It lets you get some distance from “the business” and will let you see how eager he is to see you and make time
for you.

I know my reasoning sounds cold, but I’m quite concerned that he may be in so deep that it’ll take a serious crash for him to understand what is happening. If that’s the case, what I’m suggesting lets you back off and let him crash. It’s not easy, it certainly is tough love, but as long as you give him emotional and financial support (or even stay silent and let him continue), then he’ll keep going, living on thу dreams of what his upline has brainwashed him with. The idea is to isolate him from everything but the business and let him see what happens when it all falls apart — which, from what I hear about his financial situation, is already happening. And one other point: if you do move out and he gets evicted, do NOT let him move in with you until he’s seen what’s actually going on.

We are here to help and you’re going to get a lot of different viewpoints you’ll hear from us. I’ll admit some might say I’m a pessimist, but I think I’m being pragmatic. I’ve seen the brainwashing first and and even after having worked years in residential treatment, was not prepared for how deep this brainwashing and conditioning goes.

Please, understand we are here if you have questions, need to vent or just need to ask for emotional support.

DO NOT MARRY THIS GUY

Melanie – I grew up with Amway; and am the mother to 7 adults. My first advice is this:

DO NOT MARRY THIS GUY. Not yet.

He is an addict – a Motivational Junkie. He’s involved in something that will suck his wallet dry – do NOT let your finances get mingled with his. Sooner or later, he’ll hit rock bottom, and maybe listen to your common sense (sounds like you have an ample supply, Dear!) In the meantime, he will NOT listen to you and the people in his group will be encouraging him not to. You are “negative”. An “intervention” probably won’t work right now.

So spend this time shoring up YOUR credit. YOU will have to provide for your baby daughter. Don’t be an “enabler” by letting Jerry off the financial hook, either. The sooner he crashes-and-burns, the sooner he may listen to reason??

Other will offer great ideas; and the files section has past stories that may help.

I feel bad for you

I was associated with this same blog only I am out of MI. I know of the Jacobs and there son Colby. Unfortunately in your line of sponsorship every young couple should be like “Colby the wonder boy”. My wife and I have four kids and have been married 17 years and I was sick of being compared to all the young people that are “supposed successful”

I hate to tell you this but you have no friends in that BZ. If they find out you want to quit Jerrys “Mentors” will do everything they can to destroy your relationship with him. They “tried” to divide my wife and I when she turned negative in their eyes. Unfortunately the Dussaults have twisted the BZ into something John Crowe never imagined.

Maybe with the help of Jerry’s parents you can talk some sense into him. Let him know that the only reason those people are his friends its because they are making money from him. My sponsor has not said a word to me since we quit last spring. I didn’t read but are you guys married? if not MOVE out and make some ultimatums. He needs to man up and support his family. If he can do it like a bunny with you he can start supporting you also.

My wife and I will be praying for you.

Posted in biz

I have nowhere else to go but to you, help me save my family

My name is Melanie, I am almost 21. I live in southeastern PA. I met Jerry 1 1/2 yrs ago on myspace, we were both single and looking, we met and he made me feel like a queen. He told me in passing that he was an IBO for Quixtar, I had already heard of it from a best friend and heard good things about it’s so-called 3-5 year retirement plan. Jerry said he was about to reach Platinum status in September. I didn’t mind Jerry doing this as a hobby, I didn’t hear about it much and we were falling in love.

One month after we met we became official as a couple. He asked me to go to a meeting with him bc his mentors were excited to know that he wasn’t single anymore. I suited up in a blazer and skirt with heels and walked into a Quixtar meeting held by team DC International in York, PA. He got up for the microphone and told his personal success story and that the guest he brought (me) was his girlfriend. All the hot guys in the room looked my way and cheered/clapped for Jerry. It was the most positive meeting I’d ever been to.

But I soon learned that if this was to be a winning business, there were high expectations of everyone, including Jerry. His mentors, Ed& Vicky Jacobs, were keen to talk with me with grins on their faces- saying how this business works best for couples who work together and that I should support Jerry in everything he does. They encouraged me to make myself a team with Jerry by listening to CDs and reading books, attend every meeting with him to come around the team more often.

I supported Jerry’s commitment to the business but I hadn’t been dating him that long at all, so I hardly came around the team the first few months. Our relationship was blossoming and after a couple months we were completely in love. He gave me a dozen roses one night and in bed finally said he loved me. He had practically moved into my apartment and we were making love like bunnies.

Then I found out I was pregnant, only 3 months after our dating began. It was a tough and scary decision, but we decided to keep the baby because we were sure we were in love and could do it together.

The first signs I got that not all was right with the business…was when Jerry wanted to hide the pregnancy from his mentors and anyone in the business, he didn’t want to tell until later. I started to see that Ed Jacobs had an unusual amount of influence on him and that perhaps Jerry was…ashamed? To tell his mentor about knocking up his girlfriend? Jerry told me that it was a Christian business and that those who attended the nondenominational church would frown at a child being born out of wedlock. And I had just learned that the business teaches members to stretch the truth or lie completely as a marketing/recruiting strategy. I found out Jerry was not even close to Platinum status- he had lied to me about how well he was really doing. He explained that he said he’d be Platinum only because it was the goal he set, and he was taught to “speak things into existence”.
I had to redefine the meaning of “lying” to him so he understood what wrong message he conveyed by what he said.

I had made one “friend” at the weekly meetings named Kelly, I really thought she liked me. I came to a meeting and talked in low volumes with her, told her I was pregnant. Apparently the news travelled…Jerry told me that Ed confronted him saying he’d heard and was upset that Jerry didn’t tell him first. That’s when I learned that Jerry made himself accountable to Ed for absolutely everything…every big decision he made he would run it by Ed first.

It seemed Ed & Vicky didn’t like me because they were disappointed that I wasn’t helping Jerry. I was starting to grow a belly and considering the importance of SAVING money for the baby rather than spending more on business volume. But Jerry’s mentors were teaching him that having a baby was a reason to invest MORE into Quixtar, a reason to get more done faster- supposedly to see more results.

I started to argue with Jerry about money…we didn’t have much, I wasn’t working, and with what extra he had he wanted to invest in the business DITTO volume. I fought him for every penny that I wanted to spend sooner to invest in the baby’s crib, diapers, clothing etc.. I wanted to be prepared ahead of time for our arrival. Jerry didn’t help me at all with the baby shopping. Around this time we moved in together in a 1-bdrm apt to supposedly save money, but Jerry started spending every extra he had on business. The more I learned about his finances, the more I learned that he also lied to me about how much Quixtar REALLY cost him. $300/month for volume, $8 a week for meetings, $60/month CD/CommuniKATE membership, and a few hundred every 3 months for the holy grail of all meetings- Conference weekend.

With our arguing revolved around the business, it became worse when Ed & Vicky got involved…as though I was supposed to be made accountable to them?! They sat down with us in Panera Bread and confronted me about the “negative” I was bringing into Jerry’s life, implying that his failures were my fault and that his business could only work if I was 100% supportive- their definition of supportive being…to keep my mouth shut rather than spout negative, read books and CDs, share his business duties and help give him contacts.

I was pissed with Jerry when the “intervention” was over…soon we came to an agreement that I’ll be supportive from a distance, sticking up for his business but not kissing its ass- and I told him that my job was to get everything ready for the baby. If I didn’t, it’s not like he would, right?

It should be noted that for the first year I was with Jerry his Quixtar profit ranged from $50-$300 per month, with one month of $400 but not consistently more than $250. But when he invested $300/month in product, $8/week meetings and $60/month membership…he lost more than he gained. Figure that for 3 months, the total expenses were $1200-$1500 (for meetings, membership, product and conference expenses) And the total profit could not be more than $800-$1000 for every 3 months. So every 3 months he’s wasted $200-$700 to the Quixtar business, not to mention all the time he’s had away from his pregnant fiance to go off for meetings with contacts to show the plan. He made over $2000/month net income from his fulltime job, so there’s no way he couldn’t afford our $515/month apartment, right?

Wrong. Before the baby came we were having financial problems every once-in-a-while because if there wasn’t enough money to go around, Jerry paid for his DITTO first even if that meant making his car payment or the phone bill late. DITTO always came out on the 1st of the month, no exceptions- that’s what he was taught. Apparently his mentors didn’t teach him to save a penny in the bank. We lived paycheck to paycheck. And when the baby came (a girl!) we required help from his family a lot and became financially destitute. To the point where Jerry accumulated so much credit card debt and so many bank fees for overdrawing the account- that Wells Fargo took his car payment out of his bank automatically before Jerry could stop them, and the bank stopped his use of the debit card to prevent him overdrawing the account on purpose (to borrow bank’s money he didn’t have) so he was left with no expendable income for the week- finally none to invest in the business DITTO.

By now this is the current situation, 1 1/2 years after meeting Jerry. His business has stolen his time and money, time he could have had with his infant daughter and money he could have used to buy an engagement ring. He actually proposed without a ring. Did I mention he didn’t take any photos of me while pregnant? He didn’t have enough time to make memories with me, and someone who is so religious about spending on DITTO every month, can’t find a way to afford the most important gift a guy can give to the woman they want to marry- the engagement ring? All a result of him not saving a penny to his name, hundreds accumulated to some thousands he’s wasted over 3 years of his life to Quixtar/Amway Global.

I tried confronting him about the Dateline report recently and others which have convinced me of my fears…that there is really no money- making potential for 99.9% of the IBOs. Jerry ignored me and rose to Amway’s defense, and he seriously believes he is the 1 in the thousand that will make it big regardless of what I say.

Outside of the business, and outside of arguing over the business- Jerry and I are supposedly happily engaged. But I am afraid that if I ever made an ultimatum- me or the business….that Jerry could leave me, that this is too deeply ingrained into his head to come out.

I need help to save my future life with this man I love. We have a daughter and are engaged but I don’t see him ever having the money to afford my ring or our wedding. I let slip recently to him that my family consists of a couple millionaires, and I will also be coming into some money shortly. I am afraid that as his partner I’ll also be losing to Quixtar if I allow him to get his hands on any of my money.

You’ve read my story to see how you could help me, you may be a Quixtar survivor. Rather than simply badmouthing Amway over the Internet…do you truly want to make a difference in stopping Amway’s influence, help prevent another family from getting hurt in the end? Please help my family…help find a couple other survivors and make plans with me to hold an intervention (phone or meeting) for Jerry.
He needs to hear your story and other stories…men getting left by their wives, getting into thousands of debt, men who resemble what Jerry may become if he doesn’t stop. Please, your story is important to me.

Absolutely

I just read an interesting blog (pro-mlm) that blatantly states that to be successful, people need to build a huge downline – but only sell product to avoid being labelled a “ponzi scheme.”

The focus is completely on recruiting – which is a lose-lose proposition, since it admits that the product is crap & not the reason for the organization to exist.

Posted in ACN

I was curious if anyone is doing mlm and if so have they heard of ACN

Yes, I did ACN several years ago. Like most MLM’s, unless you are extremely gifted in recruiting lots of people you will not make much money at it. The commissions on personal customers are so small you have to recruit a huge downline to make anywhere near what they claim you can. The attrition rate is so high that it’s almost always a struggle to keep your business growing.
There was also a subtle push to attend every local/regional and national events. At these events they always rolled out some new marketing tool that would make your business soar. There was a disclaimer that it wasn’t required but the message was that if you were really serious about the business you’d use all the tools and attend all events.
My monthly residual commission checks never broke the $100 barrier and that was after building down several levels. I did make some bonuses but I spent far more than I earned in the 3 years I was doing this.
I would only recommend this to someone who has killer slaes instincts and talents and no moral concerns when people you sell this opportunity to fail.

Posted in ACN